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New to GiderOS

MobiDevMarkMobiDevMark Member
edited January 2013 in General questions
Hello all,

I am a software dev mainly on desktop and looking to get into mobile.
Been looking at different options and I've narrowed it down to being Lua based, so the two I am looking at are Corona and GiderOS.

Would like to get some feedback from people who've used both.
Have played around with Corona a lot, looking at their enterprise offering and just getting into GiderOS.

Cheers

Mark
«13

Comments

  • Thanks, but I am looking for more concret examples.
    "more stable" is vague, whats that supposed to mean? I've been testing Corona out and haven't faced any issues with stability.

    I haven't done any speed tests yet, but are there any tests with latest build of both engines?
  • @MobiDevMark, have you read my blogs at http://howto.oz-apps.com it features articles on Gideros and Corona and there was one article in particular that you can use to test for yourself http://howto.oz-apps.com/2012/09/gideros-set-sprites-on-fire.html

    you can also read my book Learn Lua for iOS Game Development ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 ) that can help progress on to using Gideros apart from the various articles you can find.
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
  • Thanks OZApps, I actually went through your site (pretty cool).
    Only thing is the info is very old, things have changed since, do you have an update eval on both Corona and GiderOS?

    I am really looking for solid numbers and info not just retric, if you see what I mean.

    Will check out the book for sure.
  • @MobiDevMark, i understand what you mean, you need some bench marking figures. You will have to perhaps run those yourself with various hardware. coz the devices can be different and the numbers will vary.

    As for the info, yes the articles are old since they were written long ago, the current ones are more updated and based on Gideros. As far as eval is concerned, in Gideros no Lua functions are sandboxed, where as with C*SDK some functions are disabled. So you can easily use something like eval in Gideros without having to do much.
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
  • Ok makes sense.

    What major games have been launched with GiderOS that I can get and look at.
    I've seen Corona games having good success and some studios using them. I don't want to go down the path of an unproven tech.

    BTW why do people on this forum keep writing C*SDK?
  • Hi & welcome @MobiDevMark

    My studio has been using Gideros for all our games since early of 2012 till now.
    (website in signature)

    Though we haven't achieved much yet regarding business aspect, I hope you'll be interested in checking out our games to see what Gideros could do (though, again, ours are still simple games, other members here could have better demonstration regarding technical aspect of Gideros)

    Contact me if you need promo code to try the games, I'll be very happy to send you.
    Cheers :)
  • Will do, I saw that Crash Dummys just launched using GiderOS, which is reassuring.
    My worry is that it seems that GiderOS is not ready for prime time yet.

    How big or better yet, secure and stable is the GiderOS Corp? I am comparing it with Corona Labs which seems to be growing and raised funding.

    Do you see my concern?
  • zaniarzaniar Member
    edited January 2013
    welcome @MobiDevMark

    Maybe my personal opinion can help you
    * I can test my game quickly with Gideros Player
    * I can create my own native plugin
    * I can build my game offline

    I use C*SDK around a year ago and I don't know wether C*SDK can do that now.

    Here is our game that powered by Gideros
    https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/give-a-dam!/id546606953
  • Comparing the size (and thus somewhat "security" as you concern) between Corona "corp" and Gideros "corp", it's obviously different: Corona has already been established (it was a startup in the past though) while Gideros is still a startup.
    But many people decided to go with Corona in the past like people here decided to go with Gideros. They made a decision, and each decision has a reason and has a risk.

    Regarding technical aspect, according to many ex-corona user who moved to Gideros, they claim Gideros is competitive if not better.
  • @MobiDevMark, like benchmarking, the suitability of Gideros is relative. similarly so is the sentence that CoronaLabs is progressing, given that a co-founder leaves to start up a similar (OpenGL based mobile gaming) framework and the loss of their good engineers and most importantly delayed features which devs have been waiting for over a year *wasting* their subscription money on.

    in the end, it is purely your decision on what you feel comfortable with. Team Gideros is also VC funded and has got a second grant earlier than C*SDK. I am not sure of how long you have been in this space and know about C*SDK and Gideros. Even after being based in the heart of the silicon valley and having access to the best talent the only thing that C*SDK has achieved is marketing, hyping the name. Where as based in Turkey, a bit further away from the silicon valley, Gideros has managed to make a name on their framework than marketing and hype.

    The list of comparison can go on, look for key elements like pricing, features, tie-ups and fall-outs, staff size and outputs, helpfulness of the community, etc. Gideros is what C*SDK would have been if they did not ride the Bubble Ball fame and kept on encashing the media presence but instead added the features. Gideros needs one Bubble Ball type hype and that could change the whole scenario.

    on your question and concern, yes many studios and companies want to know that the framework that they invest time and efforts on would last. I know of someone that dissed Delphi 1.0 in favour of Visual Basic 4.0 as VB was a Microsoft product and would last in the market and be supported while Borland might not, it is funny that Delphi still exists and Microsoft has killed VB entirely ( VBdotNet is not VB )

    Ultimately it is your choice and your criteria of deciding the stability of the company.
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
  • Zaniar, downloading it now, looks polished.
    Like I said I've been testing Corona enterprise for a bit now, been liking it a lot, but don't want to commit to something and then find that it sucks afterwards.

    So I can do the native stuff with Corona and its pretty quick on testing, only diff i see in your list is the offline build, which to be honest, I am not too bothered about. I've read many posts about what if this and what if that. This applies to all tools i use, even GiderOS, as its not opensource, what if they shut down?! So not dwelling on that.

    I guess my concerns are:
    1- Is the SDK capable of doing advanced games?
    2- Are there proven cases of advanced games?
    3- Adoption rate, as in how many people are coming on this system?
    4- Is the company stable and growing, size of team etc?

    As I want to commit, i really want to make sure on things, as I did with Corona btw.

    Again, why do people on this forum write C*SDK? Am I missing something?
  • evsevs Member
    @MobiDevMark most people write it like that because they think it's an unmentionable
    evil thing :))

    I always write Corona SDK, but I don't use it anymore

    Welcome btw


    cheers

    evs
  • OZApps, I've been around the block (gray hairs showing!), so I've kept in touch of whats happening.
    I really don't care whether Carlos left or not. This is really not an indicator of anything, and to be frank I am bored and tired of people repeating this on countless forums and blogs. People come and go, and companies continue. Actually from the look of things, Corona seems to be doing a lot better without him and who ever left after!

    In any case, this fluff has no value in what I am looking for. I am looking for hard technical facts that will allow me to be comfortable dedicating my time and money of an SDK that is growing and progressing.

    No disrespect, but I don't subscribe to this type of gossip. Lets focus on merits of GiderOS technically.

    But overall thanks, I appreciate your input.
  • Thanks evs, finally I understand! Its a bit silly though.
  • Ah one more thing OZApps, where is the news on GiderOS VC funding? Couldn't find it anywhere?
  • john26john26 Maintainer
    @MobiDevMark

    Regarding native stuff to do that on corona you need an Enterprise license which, last I checked, is $3000 per year. You get the same functionality for free on Gideros (with splash screen) or a $149 per year without. That's a significant difference.

    "what if they shut down?!"

    If Gideros shuts down, you still have an iOS or Android project with .lua files clearly visible. Therefore you can continue to alter your lua game and recompile.

    If Corona shuts down you will never again be able to compile your game.
  • evsevs Member
    @MobiDevMark btw it's not a capital O in Gideros as it's not an Operating System.
    It's a beautiful place in Turkey (from the pics I've seen)

    http://flickrhivemind.net/Tags/gideros/Recent


    cheers

    evs
  • john26john26 Maintainer
    //off topic// How do you pronounce Gideros? I normally say "jee-de-ross" is that right?
  • you can at least see references to C*SDK on this forum unlike what you might see if someone even mentioned Gideros on the C*SDK forums. I guess it is more dignified than being called the Mexican Beer SDK. Majority of the developers have come from after having used C*SDK.

    If you are an enterprise user of C*SDK are you really looking for alternatives? Specially after having spend that kind of money?

    The point that you might have missed to note is with C*SDK, when your subscription expires, you cannot use the daily build you were using even to test and you can do practically nothing. Where as with any other subscription based software, the updates do not get updates anymore but you are allowed to use the last build that you were using.

    The testing bit that @Zaniar mentioned includes testing your app on the device as it would when you deployed it, this process cannot be beaten, as you press play on the IDE and you can see the app/project on your device playing, no compiling and uploading the app to the device, etc. Definitely something that cannot be achieved with C*SDK.

    on your 4 points

    1. Is the SDK capable of doing advanced games
    --> What is advanced Games?
    Have a look at @plamen's game in progress called Clouds of Steel ( https://www.facebook.com/Clouds0fSteel ) this can be one of the showcase apps for Gideros.
    2. Are there proven cases of advanced games?
    --> What is advanced? Code wise or Graphic wise?
    3. Adoption Rate
    --> While Gideros does not hype the numbers, and nor does it have every 10-13 year old wanting to write an app because Robert Nay could with C*SDK, Gideros has a slightly smaller community with a slight leaning towards developers than 10-13 year olds. Food for thought, Robert Nay started off with C*SDK, included Moai Cloud and that's that. Back to his education/etc.
    4. Is the company stable and growing...
    -->
    http://giderosmobile.com/forum/discussion/2233/gideros-mobile-is-awarded-a-government-rd-grant-from-scientific-and-technological-research-council

    and Gideros does not ask the developers for a fee to publish their apps, they provide the Community *FREE* license. yes they do not have the 12 staff that leave and take all of their work and posts/data/etc with them. So I am not sure what stability do you refer to when you say C*SDK. Definitely if people are happy handing them large sums for Enterprise subscription then they might be perceived as stable.

    The most important factor is that the co-founders of C*SDK were ex-Adobe and based in the states, this gives C*SDK a bit of an advantage in as Marketing Agencies in the states look for studios in the US to deploy mobile apps and also look for contacts that can suggest best alternatives.

    Would you want to tell us about your studio and your apps, etc. I would want to know specially given that you are an Enterprise subscriber of C*SDK.
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
  • MobiDevMarkMobiDevMark Member
    edited January 2013
    OZApps, I haven't bought the Corona enterprise license yet.
    I've been quoted $999, which lets me build offline and support native code. So technically it still more expensive than Gideros (thanks evs :-) ) $449 for the Pro.
    So its really down to what I get for the extra $550 a year that I is a premium for Corona enterprise.

    OZApps, thats not a VC fund, plus were can I see how much they've raised.

    I appreciate all your input, but please lay off the name calling and childish comments about Corona, it is really not professional and devalues all the great info you have shared.
    Plus as I mentioned before, I really don't care about all of this. I am looking for more technical substance none of this fluff.

    Love the Gideros community, minus the silly comments. I think its really worth a shot to spend the time and effort to test it out.



  • oh the Pro is only if you exceed $100k. My mistake.
  • @MobiDevMark, that’s fine, I do not understand where you see name calling etc?

    If you are so pedantic about making the right choice, then you need to also consider all the factors around the frameworks. Uptake is also about marketing and outreach.

    In the end the factors for choosing a framework might vary from person to person. Good luck with your searching, would love to hear/read about your results when you do find one that suits and also would love to hear your criteria for having reached at that decision.
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
  • ...and would you want to share a bit about yourself, your studio, your apps?
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
  • john26john26 Maintainer
    I don't recall doing any "name calling" or making "childish comments"...

    You're quoted $999 for Corona. Gideros is $149. That's a difference of $850 per year,
  • Sure, I actually just joined a studio that traditionally develops dekstop games and now we are looking to get into mobile.
    I am tasked to evaluate different frameworks for the company.
    We are a relatively medium sized studio with about 20 developers/creative. We've been operating for just over 2 years, with annual revenue of > $25m.

    Thinking about it I think we will probably have to go with the Pro subscription if we do choose Gideros.

    I was referring to your comments about people leaving Corona and insinuating that Corona developers are childish/amatures or something like that.
  • John26, maybe not name calling, but the hostility towards Corona is a little much.
    As I mentioned above, we will most likely be forced into the Pro subscription which is $449.

  • I dream of being forced into the Pro subscription.... :D

    Likes: phongtt, OZApps

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  • @MobiDevMark,
    I guess you missed the context and the intended meaning, it meant that majority of the *numbers* that you were referring to when you consider the point #3 Adoption rate, these numbers are the age group, it by no means meant that those that use C*SDK are childish or amateurs.

    BTW, ZDAY Survival simulator, one of the apps on the C*SDK infographic as the app of the week in Jan 2012 was coded by me using C*SDK. However the speed at which C*SDK features progressed was appalling and the major reason why many ex-C*SDK developers can be found on these forums.

    Would love to see your decision matrix when you are done, if you could and would share that with us.
    twitter: @ozapps | http://www.oz-apps.com | http://howto.oz-apps.com | http://reviewme.oz-apps.com
    Author of Learn Lua for iOS Game Development from Apress ( http://www.apress.com/9781430246626 )
    Cool Vizify Profile at https://www.vizify.com/oz-apps
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