Introducing Spine - 2D Skeletal Animation Tool

Nascode · January 2013

Anyone tried this?

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/esotericsoftware/spine

twisttap · January 2013

Really liked it but didnt see Gideros in the list

gorkem · January 2013

I emailed them, hoping to get Gideros into the list.

twisttap · January 2013

Thank you

Hopefully they will , the software seems so nice.

thanhquan1512 · January 2013

Cool !!!

You can try Spriter, a similar tool like this. I still don't have time to try it out.

http://brashmonkey.com/

OZApps · January 2013

@Gorkem, you might want to also get in touch with the GameJam organisers, but the way there would be to provide the tools and to sponsor the event.

Tom2012 · January 2013

Looks fantastic - there's definitely a need for a tool like this.

At the moment I build anims in flash and then export large numbers of sprites.

Spine or Spriter look like the way forward.

BJG · January 2013

@Gorkem, simply pledge $3500 and they will write an engine for you. What are you waiting for...?

]

Or you could write your own...

http://content.gpwiki.org/index.php/OpenGL:Tutorials:Basic_Bones_System

atilim · January 2013

@Nascode Also wrote a comment inspiring from yours

Thank you.

Shiu · January 2013

Hi guys, thanks for the interest. I'm the artist behind Spine, and I just wanted to let you know that we've seen your requests

There are so many different toolkits to support, that there is no way we can possible write official runtimes for all of them, however we feel we have come up with a good plan on how to support as many as possible.
We'll provide some more detailed information about this, most likely tomorrow.
Once again, THANKS!

-Søren

atilim · January 2013

Hi @Shiu,

I'm sure you're extremely busy and excited nowadays

Thank you for your great product and coming/saying hi.

Nascode · January 2013

Hello @Shiu

You guys have a great animation tool! After tried the trial, suddenly we have many ideas to use Spine on our next games

Would love to hear more about your plan to support as many engine as possible. I'm sure @atilim would be glad to help creating Gideros runtime for Spine. He is the master architect of Gideros afterall

Mells · January 2013

@Shiu
I have downloaded Spine (it looks great!) but I'm using a trackpad and after a few minutes I gave up, because I couldn't control the interface well (pan, zoom).
Do you have plans to modify how the interface works for Mac in the future, or is that set in stone?

Another question is : do you plan to support IK in the future? It's written on your kickstarter page but I couldn't get it to work in Spine.
(For those that don't know IK and for a punch example, using IK you could simply grab the hand bone of your armature and move it forward to the target, and the rest of the arm and the shoulder would naturally follow).

Additional informations shared by Nate, programmer working with @Shiu on Spine :

Hi guys, I'm Nate, the programmer for Spine. We know there are many people who are ready to jump in and write their own Spine runtime, either for a custom framework or game toolkit that doesn't yet have a runtime. This is fantastic! However, we feel that user developed runtimes should be based on a reference implementation. This makes it more likely that the runtimes will be correct and fully featured. Our approach for runtimes is not to siphon your money. They are a crucial piece for Spine and we want to make sure they are not a weak point.

Someone mentioned that they preferred how Spriter had a detailed spec and was open from the beginning. The state of Spriter's runtimes developed by the community seems poor. I just don't think the best way to go about it is to dump a spec on the community and hope they figure out how to best implement it. The runtimes for different toolkits are very similar, mostly just the rendering varies. Basing the runtimes on reference implementations makes them easier to develop and maintain, and when Spine features are added that affect the runtimes, it won't be much work to update.

I understand how some could feel that right now we seem to be neglecting those that want to develop their own runtimes. We have a lot to do and we are only 1 coder and 1 artist, but we both work on this full time. Things will change fast, promise.

We have only one runtime right now, for libgdx, and honestly it needs some more work before we would consider it complete. Well before the end of the Kickstarter we will have the libgdx runtime up to par, and hopefully a head start on runtimes for additional toolkits. We know everyone is watching and we are very grateful for those who put their faith in us. We hope to impress.

jvdm · February 2013

Spine looks really great. i've signed up as a backer... hopefully the developer adds in support for Gideros. $30 well spent IMHO.

MikeHart · February 2013

Everywhere I read something from the Spine folks, there downgrade Spriter. Are they so low is confidence, that they need to put other tools down? Make me not wanting to buy such a tool.

Mells · February 2013

@MikeHart
The excerpt that I have copy-pasted was given as an answer to how different from Spriter Spine is. (I was searching for it).
It makes sense anyway to differentiate a product from its competitors and I don't see here where they downgrade Spriter? ("seems", "think").
They just express their opinion and I saw once that they were backers for Spriter and decided to make their product public after some disappointments.
It makes sense to tell us what the disappointments were so we can make our own opinion about it?

At least in this discussion, I don't know much about the other places where you read things from them.

I think I'll buy both anyway, huge time savers.

bowerandy · February 2013

@Mells, @MikeHart, I also backed Spriter on KickStarter all those moons ago. Since then, every few weeks the backers have received e-mails about further delays and notice that each slipped deadline is again going to be missed. I guess many people got fed up and may even have written the project off completely. This maybe why the Spine folks started on their software. I agree that denigrating other peoples software is generally considered "poor form".

It turns out from a recent Spriter mailshot that the main coder has had some health issues over the last few months. This does make one feel for him but doesn't boost confidence that the project will reach a timely conclusion.

best regards

Shiu · February 2013

Just wanted to let you know that we're working on an update which will likely be posted a couple of hours from now and it will have more information about which toolkits we will be working on.

@Mells we have some plans for IK in the future, but we omitted it from version 1.0 to be able to get a stable release out with the core features. We have already talked about how we would want to implement IK if we decide to do so, and while it could be done relatively quick, we want to make sure that if implement it, we do it right.
Currently we have IK in Spine but this is for posing. For animation we need to make sure that the runtimes can support it, or we need to be able to plot IK animation, which can be done, but is not as powerful as being able to calculate IK at runtime.
We're also looking into making Spine easier to use with a touchpad.

Also I'd like to address some concerns that have been brought up.

Spine and Spriter can co-exist and many people have asked us how it compares to Spriter and why we think they should pick Spine. Our reply to this has been that we think it's best for people to try out both and see which one they prefer.
The reason we made Spine, was that when we tested Spriter and a couple of other options, they did not cover our needs, but specifically in the case of Spriter, we were afraid development of it was too slow and we needed transforms to be keyed separately.
With that said, Spriter has some great features and we wish the team behind it all the luck in the future.

BJG · February 2013

Thanks for the update Shiu. Looks like a great product.

gorkem · February 2013

Thanks Shiu for the follow-up

Shiu · February 2013

We've now update the Kickstarter with stretch goals. It's been a super long day and I really need to get some sleep, but this should give you a few more details. The generic runtimes will be relatively easy to implement with Gideros and we'll provide direct support should it be needed.
If you have more specific questions, feel free to ask

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/esotericsoftware/spine/posts

Mells · February 2013

@Shiu
Thank you for stopping by

"A Spine runtime in the Lua programming language. This enables easier development of Spine runtimes for Gideros, LÖVE, Moai, and others."

* Love *

I like the updated stretched goals.
It shows that you have a clear vision of the roadmap and where the product is going.

Nascode · February 2013

Thanks a lot @Shiu

Where we could get the generic lua runtime? Would love to create games with Spine

talis · February 2013

Seems like really handy tool. Hope to see it running soon and my congratulations to the team behind it =D>
Thanks again @Shiu

jvdm · February 2013

wonderful news!!! thanks a stack @Shiu - i'm so looking forward to working with Spine

(*)

BJG · February 2013

Great stuff @Shiu.

Shiu · February 2013

@Nascode when we have the generic lua runtimes ready I'll give you an update in here.

Thanks everyone! Happy to see that you like the stretch goals, please help us by spreading the word of the Kickstarter

GregBUG · February 2013

one question:

but lua runtime for this "kind" of computations is not a little bit hard for lua interpreter ?
is not too "heavy" for a game?

Shiu · February 2013

@GregBUG it's really hard to say. It depends on a lot of things. The example projects will run just fine with lua. You need to factor in the amount of bones and images you use. As well as the amount of entities using bones shown on screen at the same time.
Gideros seem to be able to use C++ as well, so that is also an option if you need a little extra power. But seasoned Gideros user can probably elaborate a bit more on that, than I will be able to.

zaniar · February 2013

@Shiu
Maybe, what @GregBUG want to ask is: "So, there is an opportunity for me to create native plugin for Spine?" :-D

BJG · February 2013

With any luck the project will reach its $28K target for a generic C++ runtime, then @GregBUG can implement it in both so we can compare.

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