Gideros Player on iOS

Venorcis

Hello,

First of all: I love Gideros and the quick-deployment features it provides using the Gideros Player. This is especially very easy through something like Dropbox for Android devices; installing the player is a piece of cake! However, on iOS this process is much more complicated, requiring custom builds on a Mac and such (even though http://members.giderosmobile.com/knowledgebase.php?action=displayarticle&id=3 does not mention that).

I understand this is not an app that can be in the App Store or anything, but wouldn't it be possible to deploy more easily through some less conventional ways? E.g. through the Cydia (jailbroken) app store. I think it would be very easy to submit the Gideros Player to a common repository (bigboss / modmyi) or even create a custom accessible end-point. In my opinion this would greatly accomodate the iOS development cycle using Gideros, as most developers do not have a problem with jailbroken devices anyway (and of course, otherwise, the regular xcode/mac/compile method is still available as well).

Thank you for your time,
-Vincent

ar2rsawseen

Distrubuting Gideros Playr on Cydia would make us endorse developers jailbreak their devices, what we really don't want to do.
But we have some plans on how it could be done, just need to experiment with it more, once we set up the build server, and maybe (just maybe) something similar to what you described will be available.

OZApps

@ar2rsawseen,
Can we not have the player on the app store, so that anyone that wants to start can download it and play with it.

While any of us can put it up on the store, it would be better if it was put by GiderosMobile than any body else.

While as a developer, we can all sign and upload the player to our devices, but in the case where there are non-developer license holders (like in a class) it is difficult to provide a working copy to them. So if the player was on the App Store, it makes it so much easier and that way, everytime there is a new release, we would have the latest player (lesser incompatibilities)

On the point that this cannot be on the app store, that is incorrect, There are several other apps that are similar and are on the app store.

However, specific builds like with BHWax and other custom plug-ins, we might have to build for individual testing, or maybe the plug-in system could also be made modular to upload plug-ins externally, like DLL's...

ar2rsawseen

On the point that this cannot be on the app store, that is incorrect, There are several other apps that are similar and are on the app store.

Thats interesting, because Gideros Player was both previously submitted and Apple representatives contacted, which replied that they could not do anything for us.

Maybe something's changed, could you please list the similar apps, so we could make a case with Apple representatives?

OZApps

@ar2rsawseen,
The first that comes to mind is the AppGameKit this used to be a Windows only IDE at the time but required an iOS component (player) that ran the code OTA (over The Air) like what Gideros does.

http://reviewme.oz-apps.com/2011/09/rev-your-engines.html

Here's an except from their site about this

AGK Player Service

You can find the AGK Player on most stores now as a free download, allowing you to instantly test your apps on various devices. The only exception to this is on iOS where such an app is incompatible with Apple rules, for which we have released the free AGK Viewer app on the App Store which does a similar job of allowing you to test your apps. In 2011, it was only possible to get the AGK Player on your device if you had a Mac. In 2012, it's now possible to have the AGK Player app run on your iOS device without a Mac, and we call it the AGK Player Service which will install the app onto your iPhone, iPad and iPod Touch.

We will guide you thorough the process of setting up the certificate files from Apple, and then we will build the IPA file for you which can be installed onto multiple iOS devices. The service includes the initial set-up, a free second round of device additions and three free player updates as they become available. If you run out of these, you can simply buy another service and get an additional round of device additions and a fresh set of three player updates.

OZApps

Links, for the apps,

On the Mac App Store -> https://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/agk-player/id453703978?mt=12

on iTunes -> http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/agk-viewer/id474721435?ls=1&mt=8

ar2rsawseen

Aha, so AGK Viewer basically shows you the stream from your PC/Mac and not actually runs app on the device.

But that is completely different and not really applicable here.

Venorcis

Thanks for the responses.
I do not really agree that providing a Cydia download would 'endorse' jailbreaking your device by Gideros. One always has an option to do it the 'current' way by building it yourself right? I think that with a very minor action that anyone can take (e.g. putting the compiled app on some repository) developers that want to take advantage of this are greatly supported. This two-way approach would benefit anyone without harming anyone right?

In any way, I'm curious about the other 'plans' you have for this problem.

bowerandy

@Venorcis, as far as I can see, there can be only one real reason why you would rather have a version of the Gideros player to run Jailbroken on an iOS device - and that is to avoid paying the $99 iOS developers' fee and having the appropriate Mac hardware to build the player. If you have these things (because you intend to actually develop for iOS) then building the player is easy. Perhaps, an improved tutorial would help with the only tricky bit, which is sorting out certificates etc.

If you don't have these things and just want to play your Gideros games on an iPhone or iPod (which I can understand) then this is deliberately against Apple's developer policy and for this reason I think it would be an unwise endorsement for Gideros to make.

I guess Gideros could "turn a blind eye" to any of their users building such a player and putting it up on a jailbreak site. Why not try it yourself and see if @atilim (or the others) issue you with a takedown notice?

best regards

atilim

@bowerandy Totally agree. And as a side note, now installing the certificates through Xcode is very easy. You just need to plug your device and click Organizer > "Add to Portal" and Xcode automatically installs the developer and distribution certificates to your Mac.

@Venorcis Internally, we were talking about distributing Gideros Player by using Apple's wireless app distribution. But we don't have enough technical knowledge about it and currently this option has low priority.

And unfortunately distribution of Player through Cydia is out of option.

OZApps

@Atilim, when you say Wireless App Distribution, do you mean using the Enterprise license and In-House application distribution?

If it is something else, I am not quite sure what you mean here.

atilim

@OZApps I meant In-House application distribution but after talking @ar2rsawseen I remembered that the original idea was providing a simple resigning server only for player. Here you upload your provisioning profile through web, our server resigns the player and provides a download link.

Venorcis

@bowerandy Thank you for your explanation; I guess the Apple Developer Policy would be the only thing that's stopping this?
Again the issue is more the comparison between Android (put file on dropbox - open - done) and iOS (pay fee, set-up tools, compile source code, sort out certificates, etc.). In the start-up phase (when trying out Gideros to see if it fits your needs/purposes) or in early development (alpha versions), paying the iOS fee and setting up Mac hardware (which not everyone has readily available) is a huge deal. But I guess this is more of an Apple issue (especially if their developer policies are as strict as you say they are) than a Gideros one, although offering more ease in the early trial phases is of course in Gideros' interest as well.

Thanks for the replies anyway ( @atilim as well of course)

OZApps

@atilim, that would defeat the purpose, where people that do not have a developer license would be unable to use it (students for example, or enthusiasts perhaps) and each developer would have to use up their device licenses (99 max) to provide these which would not be a good idea.

If you have the enterprise developer version, you can put the app on a website for in-house distribution (away from Apple) or does that have 500 licenses only??

ar2rsawseen

@OZApps that was also one of our ideas that we started researching and found that there was a service, can't remember the name now, that also used the enterprise license not for employees, but for clients and got its enterprise license shut down by Apple.
In Gideros case it will be even worse (allowing developers to bypass buying license) so consequences may be even worse.

OZApps

@ar2rsawseen, that was the Russian service that allowed GIT Hub source code to be compiled and installed onto the device. Apple shut it down because some journalists picked up the article and took dibs at Apple (over publicized it).

Apple cancelled their license as it was being used to compile and run Emulators, to which Apple had a problem. In the case of Gideros that should not be a problem as it would be used to distribute only Gideros Player.

However, if @Atilim has the Enterprise license then he could also write to Apple and discuss this option with them.

atilim

The service is http://try.macbuildserver.com

@OZApps as you've said, previously everyone can download and install .ipa files from their server without any provisioning files but now they require to upload your own provisioning files for signing. You can try from https://github.com/vanger-cat/Hello-MacBuildServer